Up Close & Personal
Goldstein, a true Renaissance Man, was born with the rare gift
of genius that was manifesting by the time he was three years old when
he could sit down at the piano and play by ear. By the time he was eight,
he would go to the movies and was able to play songs and themes after
seeing the film just once.
With William Goldstein
The Musical Journey of a Boy Prodigy to World Renowned
Composer and Electronic Technology Pioneer
William Goldstein in his Laurel Canyon studio.
Photo: Beverly Cohn.
His musical accomplishments, which span all musical
genres, are legion, scoring 50 film and TV projects, including
48 episodes of "Fame," Disney's "The
Miracle Worker," "Twilight Zone" and "Shocker."
He is a founder of the Museum of Contemporary Art in Los Angeles,
a director of the California State Summer School for the Arts,
and serves on both the Music Branch Executive Committee and Foreign
Language Committee of the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences.
Goldstein also achieved prominence as an innovator of new technology
and pioneered the first completely computer sequenced direct digital
score for a Peter Guber project called "oceanQuest"
which CBS Masterworks released as "Oceanscape,"
and created the first full musical score for an interactive computer
game called "King's Quest Four" which revolutionized
that industry. He is also a roving ambassador for the Academy
and lectures all over the world on contemporary aesthetics and the role
of music in film.
Little Billy Goldstein at age 5 had already
the piano since he was three. Courtesy
Mr. Goldstein recently sat down with your
reporter in his studio for an exclusive interview and the following
has been edited for content and continuity.
Cohn: What happened when you were nine years old
at Columbia University?
Goldstein: I was there for an interview and an evaluation
with Professor Raymond Burrows at the Teachers College
at Columbia because I was a child prodigy. But we should back
up before then. I grew up in a non-musical family. We didn't have a
piano in the house. My mother couldn't carry a tune, but she liked classical
music. My parents were in the hotel business and during the summer,
we lived in the summer hotel where there was a piano. I was told that
when I was three or four I started picking out stuff on the piano.
The Goldstein New Jersey family home. Courtesy
Goldstein: My parents moved into the house I grew up
in when I was nine. Before that we lived in a two-story house and the
girl downstairs had a piano so I could play occasionally, but my parents
didn't buy me a piano until I was eight. I remember that when I was
eight, my parents went to California and we were at my great
aunt's house in Stockton for two months. She had a piano and
I had a tremendous breakthrough. That summer I was going to the movies
and going home and playing scores, themes, and songs I heard. What I
imagine happened, because I don't really know, is that some of the very
sophisticated guests at our summer hotel said that my parents had to
do something about this kid which is how I wound up going to Columbia
University for that evaluation, which I remember very well.
Cohn: What was the result of that meeting?
Goldstein: Burrows ideally wanted me to go a
conservatory. In the old days, you sent your kids to live in a host
home in Moscow or Berlin, but that wasn't going to fly.
He said if I couldn't study full time, how about once a week in the
prep division. The prep division met on Saturday but my folks
were Orthodox Jews so that wasn't going to fly either. Burrows
said he would get me a teacher at a convenient time.
He really wanted to see that you got the proper
Goldstein: Oh yes. He said something that blew me away.
You know I didn't feel special. I just did what I did. But, at the end
of this evaluation period, my mother said it wasn't practical for us
to do any of these things and Burroughs looked at her straight
in the eyes and said, 'Trying to stop him would be like trying to stop
the river heading to the sea." My mother did try to find someone
in Lakewood (New Jersey) to teach me the piano but I was
already playing and the only teacher she could find, who was a Julliard
graduate, told me that I had to stop playing by ear. Well, if I heard
something, I played it. That was never going to stop. So that lasted
just a couple of weeks and that was it. So, I'm a classically trained
pianist who never took piano lessons.
Cohn: When did you learn to read music?
Goldstein: Reading music came much later. I think in
eighth grade I started playing trumpet so I read treble clef, but I
didn't learn how to read bass clef until I was close to sixteen or seventeen.
When I was eighteen, I was able to write my first orchestral work, which
was performed when I was nineteen and made the front page of the Asbury
Park Press and I said to myself I can do all this without studying
Cohn: Given that you were a child genius, did
you live a rarified life?
A dashing young Goldstein in his United States
Army Band uniform. Courtesy photo.
Goldstein: I lived a rather normal life except I was
one of the youngest kids in my class but I was one of the most emotionally
insensitively developed, but I didn't know that. How could I know it?
So, outside of the fact that I could sit down at the piano and do stuff,
I played tackle football with the other kids, went sledding in the winter,
and during the summers I was a really good belly surfer. In high school,
I was voted the most talented in my class.
Cohn: What did you do after you graduated college?
Goldstein: I was fortunate enough to become composer
in residence during the Vietnam War for the United States Army
Band in Washington D.C. and was commissioned to write music,
including a trombone concerto when I was 25. It is the most performed
trombone piece and has been recorded eight or nine times by principal
trombonists around the world and this year was selected by the International
Trombone Association as the their competition piece. Eventually,
I signed a contract with Columbia Pictures/Screen Gems in New
York so I was with their publishing company, which was the place
to be. It had everybody, including Carole King.
Cohn: How did Motown's Berry Gordy find you?
Goldstein: The Screen Gems thing led to my first
movie and then I did a lot of work for ABC Television and the
connection with Berry Gordy came about when I was asked to write
the theme music for the morning show, "AM America."
I was also doing a lot of commercials and Gordy got in touch
with me to do a singles deal where I would produce as well as be an
artist and composer.
Mr. Goldstein's "Celebration Overture - 1776-1976"
was premiered at the Kennedy Center by the National Symphony and was
on the same program with Copeland, Brahms, and Stravinsky. Courtesy
Cohn: Did you enjoy all of those roles?
Goldstein: I enjoyed everything. During the period when
I was a Motown artist, I had just done my first movie score and
the National Symphony was premiering my "Celebration
Overture - 1776-1976," so I was wearing three hats movie
composer, disco artist on Motown, and symphony composer.
Cohn: Are you equally at home playing jazz and
classical and who are some of the composers who influenced you?
Goldstein: I play jazz, but I would not call myself
a jazz artist. You might say I'm equally as uncomfortable with jazz
and classical because I don't fit in anywhere. All the great classical
composers have influenced me. I was improvising inventions at the keyboard,
which are little Baroque pieces with a couple of ideas that interact
with each other. I was doing these things in the style of Bach
before I knew Bach. We didn't meet until a few years later. Then
when I was at Motown, I did this thing called "Back to
Bach," which was a disco record. I love all the Russian
romantics: Rachmaninoff, Tchaikovsky, and the French:
Debussy, Ravel and American: Leonard Bernstein
and Aaron Copland, whom I met when I was a student. I'm influenced
by everything I've ever heard and as far as favorites, I can't choose
because I'm a person of great empathy.
William Goldstein (rear) with students from the
Las Vegas Academy of the Performing Arts who participated in his Master
Class. Courtesy photo.
Cohn: You conduct Master Classes from Las Vegas
to Poland. How did that come about?
Goldstein: When I was doing FAME, a number of
people in the industry around 1981, decided to start the California
State Summer School for the Arts. It's a fabulous program. We take
high school students from all disciplines in the arts music, acting,
writing, photography, and production design and take over Cal
Arts for a four-week intensive program. Graduates of our program
include James Franco, a lot of the guys at Pixar, and
Broadway performers, and singers. We're turning out a lot of
people who go on to become very successful. I'm a board member and once
a year I do a Master Class. Outside of being a visiting artist
here and there, that was the extent of sharing what I knew because I
didn't know I had anything to share. The other thing is I earned a nice
living writing, but my real gift is sitting at the piano and doing instant
compositions. A: I didn't think it was that special and B:
I didn't know anybody else who did it, but I didn't think it was as
rare as I now know it is. I only know one other person who does it full
time and that's Keith Jarrett. I know people who improvise, but
improvisation in jazz is very different because it's improvisation around
an existing structure or piece. What I'm doing is starting with nothing
and creating something. Later, I'll ask you to pick three notes on the
piano and those three notes will become the first three notes of the
melody. That sort of insures that it is not something I've done in the
Cohn: Were there specific events that changed
Goldstein: What really changed my life were two things:
One: Rob Jaffe, the Executive Director of the California State Summer
School for the Arts, who sadly passed away a few years ago, found
out about the instant compositions and suggested that I share my creative
experience and show the kids what I do. This is what I had been doing
since I was a kid, but that experience changed my life.
Cohn: How did the Transatlantyk International
Film and Music Festival in Poznan, Poland come about?
Goldstein: That was the second thing that changed my
life. My instant compositions didn't really get big until in 2011
Jan Kaczmarek invited me to a festival he was putting on in Poland.
He and I were talking at an Academy Music Branch meeting and
I told him I had just released my second solo piano album of instant
compositions. He said that was a lost art and that he wanted to have
a competition in instant composition and invited me to be on the jury
and do some performances. So I did and became president of the jury,
did workshop performances; improvised ballets with dancers, musical
conversations with singers, and it changed my life because the response
was just amazing. We had 50 contestants from the entire world and not
one of then could do the three-note exercise. So I began to realize
that what I do is very rare.
Mr. Goldstein at the piano composing an instant
composition for your reporter.
Photo: Beverly Cohn.
Cohn: Can you explain your process for creating
an instant composition?
Goldstein: So what is the essence of what I'm doing
at the piano how am I doing that? I'm doing it the same way you
get up in the morning and have a conversation with somebody. How do
you speak? How is it possible for you to have an idea and express it
to another human being? Well, it takes a vocabulary. So, I have a musical
vocabulary a very broad musical vocabulary. Then it takes a method
of delivery. How do you get your sentences out? You speak them, right?
And, the most important part of the anatomy involved in speech is your
tongue and the miracle of the tongue is that you don't have to tell
it where to go, do you? Nobody thinks about the tongue in his or her
mouth. When I'm doing my master classes and ask people what part of
your anatomy is most involved in speech, students mention the brain,
the vocal chords or what nobody thinks of the tongue. Nobody thinks
about the tongue because it's so automatic. So, if you want to do what
I do, just build a musical vocabulary and then build a technique that's
so natural that you don't have to think about it. So my fingers on the
keyboard are like the tongue in my mouth, and that's the gift I was
Cohn: How do you teach this to budding young composers?
For a while, I was reluctant to do this because you
can't teach anybody the gift, but finally, after years, I began to understand
what the gift is and in explaining what the gift is to artists, I believe
that having that knowledge, and increasing their vocabulary, and the
level of competence with their instrument so that it becomes more natural,
this knowledge will easily move anybody from one place to a much more
open place and help them get in touch with their own creativity. That
said, technique has always been a means to an end not the end
Cohn: What is your teaching schedule like?
Goldstein: I'm really focusing on sharing the gift of
instant composition. Last year was a banner year. In September
and October I went on a five-week cross-country tour of performing
arts high schools organized by the Executive Director of the California
State Summer School for the Arts, Peggy Burt. This was an eye-opening
tour in so many ways. When I got to the Denver School of the Arts,
one of the finest in the country, half way through my day there, at
a faculty lunch, the principal of the school said that he wanted to
commission me to write a couple of pieces and wanted me to be the principal
speaker at a conference in Colorado Springs which I just attended
in January. I talked to all the music honor students in the state.
This prolific composer conducting a Master Class
in Kiev, Ukraine. Courtesy photo.
I was in Kiev last month and am going back to
Poland in March and have invitations from Toronto
and China. So, it's all about the instant compositions. The kids
love it and the music students love it; people of all ages respond in
very emotional ways.
Cohn: Let's switch to films. The Academy Awards
are coming up. Any favorites?
Goldstein: I haven't decided what I'm going to vote
for yet. I loved "Lincoln." I loved "Les Mis,"
("Les Miserables") I really liked "Argo."
I don't think "Zero Dark Thirty," is going to win the
Oscar. It was a really good film, but "Argo"
is a better film. "Argo," from the beginning of it,
just never lets up. What I am curious about in regard to "Zero
Dark Thirty" is what her (Director Kathryn Bigelow)
political agenda is. She says she's not endorsing the use of force in
interrogations, but of course it's war, and in this film, the outcome
depends upon those techniques.
Cohn: Piggybacking on that, what do you think
the overarching responsibility of the artist should be?
Goldstein: I think we should be as truthful as possible
and that we should also try to be as inspiring as possible and if we're
going to bring about change, we should put out positive energy. Whatever
we're doing, no matter how vicious or terrible the story is we're telling,
it should have something uplifting attached to it. A much more interesting
question is not with "Zero Dark Thirty," but with "Amour,"
which is an extraordinarily tough film. I'm on the Foreign Language
Committee and that film is probably going win, but it's not my favorite
film and yet it is heart wrenching. But, what's the point of making
a film like this that doesn't help somebody do something about a horrific
human condition. None of us can escape the end of our lives but the
end of everybody's lives is not like that. I like things that not only
illuminate the human condition, but also somehow offer hope or a positive
solution or resolution.
Cohn: Not much has been written about your personal
life. Have you ever been married?
Goldstein: The odd thing about my life is that I've
had a perfectly normal career as an artist. I was able to put myself
through my last five of seven years of college with my earnings as a
composer but never had a real life. In a spiritual sense, everything
I have in life I've been given and anything I don't have has been kept
from me. I fell in love when I was thirteen years old. She lived on
a farm, but I couldn't go out with her until I was seventeen. When I
finally went out with her, I told her I loved her and she said that
she liked me very much but I'm not in love with you. So, she broke my
heart. I don't know if I ever kissed this girl. She was like on a pedestal.
Honestly, I believe things happen when they are supposed to happen and
the right person will be there at the right time.
Over the years people were attracted to me because of
what I do. I do have to say that I am an incurable romantic personally,
and it comes out in my music in a neo-romantic style.* I'll share one
memorable relationship. I was on my way to a Club Med trip in
Guadeloupe and met a girl on the plane. We started talking, met
later in the day on the beach, and decided to room together for the
week. We ended up in a relationship that lasted a couple of years. It
was wonderful. She was an artist. She was someone I should have married
but I wasn't ready.
Cohn: With all your extraordinary accomplishments,
is there anything in your life that feels unfinished and if so, what
is your philosophical take on it?
Goldstein: Sure. My personal life. But, everything happens
in time and half the fun is getting there. If there is a master of the
universe, the master of the universe has created this world to guarantee
and insure conflict on every level. There are animal species doves,
beavers, wolves, swans they mate once and stay loyal to that mate.
They don't leave that mate and if the mate dies, they very rarely re-mate.
Then there's the rest of the animal species that jumps on anything that
moves. If there is a master of the universe, we could have been created
like that, but we were not and because we are in "earth school",
and in "earth school" we learn life's lessons by resolving
the challenges put in our path, and they are all in the form of conflict.
Whether it's one-on-one in the bedroom or one-on-one in the boardroom,
or a war between two countries, dominance, trust, control, and territory
is what it's almost always about. Human beings need constant positive
stimulation. To expect all that positive stimulation to come from one
person is not reasonable and people could have better relationships
if they would realize that the other person is never the person they
want them to be, but only the person who they are and they should try
to see them as they are and not as you want them to be. Remember, the
only things that work between two people are those things that are mutually
desirable and if there is true love for one human being for another,
it is not challenged by love for one human being for another because
there is a unique dynamic between every two individuals that is not
replicable with any other two individuals. And, that's what I've learned
Cohn: Why do you think it's so difficult to find
that special person?
Goldstein, (center) is surrounded by students
from one of his Master Classes which he conducted abroad.
Goldstein: The more unusual and unique a person you
are, the harder it is to find someone. I get along with lots of people
and have lots of relationships this person on this level, that
person on that level. I connect with lots of people, which is one of
the reasons I didn't marry early because I realized that because I connect
with so many people, how do you just be with one person. Those five
days being in Colorado Springs around all those talented young
people was amazing.
I seem to have a remarkable effect on young people,
many followed me around during the festival asking questions, wanting
to be photographed with me, and a few said they wished I could adopt
them. What's exciting is they're at a point in their lives where everything
is possible and it's great to be around people with hope and energy.
I make a point when I'm lecturing that in order to really have any success
as an artist, you must never lose contact with your inner child because
you have to be able to feel and respond without the adult filters and
with most adults, the filters are on all the time. So that's the thing
about young people that I find attractive. But, of course, to find a
younger person who's got that wonderful energy and has enough life experience
to share with you is a challenge. I mean if you're going to have a mate,
it's got to be somebody who is in tune with you in so many areas. I'm
not really smart enough to have an answer to that one
Posing in front of their Lakewood, N.J. hotel in
1942, little Billy's parents are totally unaware that they are holding
a budding musical prodigy who would have an illustrious musical career.
"Genius is not the ability to
take the commonalities of life and make them obtuse, but rather to take
the complexities of life and give them meaning."
is a movement that began in Britain around 1880, which crossed artistic
boundaries emphasizing the importance of the representation of internal
To see the complete discography of Mr. Goldstein's
over 50 works: http://williamgoldstein.com/index.html